Taking care of Silver Age comics: need advice

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Author	Topic: Taking care of Silver Age comics: need advice
dylanfan Member	posted April 25, 2003 12:53 PM I am going to be helping a friend care for his pretty awesome Silver Age comic collection. He has complete runs of the first 100 or so issues of Fantastic Four, Daredevil, Silver Surfer, and Spider-Man, as well as assorted other issues of early Thor, Strange Tales, TtA, ToS and Avengers. He bought these in his childhood and has managed to take pretty good care of them since then. Many of his oldest comics look fantastic, with square corners, nice staples and sharp edges. He is of the mind to sell them, and I will probably be trying to help him do that soon, but the first thing we want to do is replace old bags and backing boards that he's had on these things for many years. Where is the best place to get such items as super-acid free boards and bags for this era comics? I want the best quality stuff at the best price, of course. If anyone has had any experience in this matter and can provide recommendations, I would greatly appreciate it. As for me, it's a sheer pleasure to help my friend with this project. For the first time, I have been able to hold a copy of FF #1 and Spider-Man #1, and gently turn each page and behold it. The feeling is pretty amazing- I highly recommend it! (No, unfortunately he doesn't have Amazing Fantasy #15. One of the real oddities of his collection, which is mostly Silver Age Marvel, is a really old copy of Whiz Comics. That was pretty damned cool!) ------------------ Visit the Marvel Masterworks fansite and Message Board: Go to www.marvelmasterworks.freeservers.com IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted April 25, 2003 01:11 PM Wow! That'd be a lot of fun. if you get the chance, can you do a comparison between the originals and the reMasterworks? I'm particulary curious about the line work, since it seemed washed out in last year's Spidey volumes. IP: Logged
Astronaut Jones New Member	posted April 25, 2003 05:10 PM I would recommend you use mylar sleeves. These pretty much never have to be changed, unlike the cheap polypropylene bags you get at most comic stores. http://bcemylar.com is the manufacturer's site. Since you're going to need a pretty large quantity, I would get mylites (Arklites on the bcemylar site), which just use a thinner mylar. They're quite a bit cheaper than the 4-mil mylar sleeves, but still archival quality. Looks like 1000 Arklites will cost $103 + shipping. 1000 Mylars will cost $247 + shipping. They also sell a variety of truly acid-free backing boards too ($87 for 1000 of their Thin-x-tenders). Anyway, if he's really serious about archival quality stuff, that's what I would recommend. I wouldn't just go down to the local comic shop and buy 1000 of the cheap bags they sell for $4 per 100. I have found that Graham Crackers Comics (http://www.grahamcrackers.com/supplies.htm) has a good price on 100 arklites ($22.95 compared to $40 from the manufacturer) if you don't need a thousand of them. Good luck, it would probably be fun, except for it being all Marvel piffle. :-D IP: Logged
vze2 Member	posted April 25, 2003 05:54 PM Astronaut Jones is right. Bill Cole (the bc in bcemylar) is the only manufacturer that I will ever use again. They regularly have discounts, but the normal price is a fair one. Their product is that much better. Like Astronaut Jones said, Arklites and Thin-X-Tenders are what you want. I've tried the more expensive stuff, and you really don't need it, especially if the new owner plans on actually reading the comics. They also sell a variety of acid-free boxes. Once again, the price is fair because the product is so good. IP: Logged
Marty Raap Member	posted April 25, 2003 08:12 PM How to care for Silver Age comics? Like each one is the love of your life and you're Barry White. IP: Logged
dylanfan Member	posted April 25, 2003 08:28 PM quote: Originally posted by Marty Raap: How to care for Silver Age comics? Like each one is the love of your life and you're Barry White. Awwww.....that's sweet, Marty. Hey, thanks for the advice, guys. I am going to go check out that website right now! If anyone else wants to speak up and let me know some more dos and dont's, I would appreciate it! ------------------ Visit the Marvel Masterworks fansite and Message Board: Go to www.marvelmasterworks.freeservers.com IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted April 26, 2003 03:31 AM If your friend doesn't want to spring for mylar, which is after all pretty pricey, plastic bags are fine provided you use the right type of plastic: Get polypropylene, not polyethylene. It's damn near as chemically inert as mylar. It doesn't get that yellowish or cloudy look that polyethylend does after a few years, and more importantly doesn't get that somewhat tacky feel, indicating that horrible chemicals are volatilizing out of it and into your comics. I think a collection sheathed in polypropylene bags and stiffened with good quality backing boards is as well protected as one in mylar, and for a fraction the cost. There's another problem with mylar: I don't know if anyone has tried to purchase a large amount lately, but it can't be had in quantity just now. Maybe with the war over and resources being freed up for other uses, whatever factor was making it unavailable will end, but we've been trying to get an order of Silver Age size mylar sleeves for months now from a usually reliable supplier, with no luck. And of course, over the long term, unless the comics are exposed to some really noxious chemical substance, protection from light, heat and above all humidity are probably most important. Remember that the Mile High Collection was stored in stacks on open shelves with no protection at all, but in a high-altitude, low-humidity environment. IP: Logged
SteelBat2002 Member	posted April 26, 2003 06:11 AM All good advice. Mylar/Mylite. I'd like to add a few things here that haven't been mentioned. 1) It is right in any instance to use Mylite and acid free boards to preserve SA, GA, and BA comics. And in some instances even Modern, depending on the value and grade of the comic. 2) I personally prefer EGerber products. I find his prices much more reasonable and also he offers a Mylite 2, which is a 2mil bag. Bill Cole offers only a 1 mil and 4 mil. I find the 1 mil bags to have the stiffness of saran wrap and the 4 mil overkill. 3) Concerning Mylites: Sizes: For 32 page SA books, as a rule you will need the Standard size Mylites (7 1/4" X 10 3/4"). If you also have the giants and annuals of that era you will need the Silver/Gold size (7 3/4" X 10 3/4"). Of course you could just buy the Silver/Gold size for all but I find that to do this leaves much too much room side to side for standard size books. Just my personal preference. I like the "neater" and tightness side to side of this type of storage. 4) Concerning boxes: Very important. If you are going to box these comics and I'm sure that your friend is. You will need a box to accomodate these storage measures. Your standard comic shop fare of boxes, (Comic Defense), are virtually useless. They are for one, not wide enough for S/G Mylites and two, they are not tall enough. These standard comic shop boxes are almost the exact heighth of a Modern comic and when stacking will crunch the spines. So imagine what will happen to older books. I have my collection in EGerber half boxes which accomodate books back to the Golden Age using the storage methods I mentioned above. Especially if you are going to use Mylar sleeves instead of or in conjunction with the Mylites. Some of my more valuable books I keep in both. Just my obsessive personality. Mylar sleeves will extend above the book itself a good inch or more above the top of the book. 5) Boards: I guess you could say I'm skimping but I do use standard acid free Comic Defense boards. I find with the stiffness afforded by the Mylite 2's and a standard 24pt acid free board that seems quite sufficient for protection. *On a personal note concerning boards. I have found that using SA or GA boards with these Mylites that they leave a gap side to side so what I have done is use magazine size boards and cut them down so the board reaches completely side to side. I hope some of this helps. I can't stress enough though about the boxes. You will definitely need the heighth and width. They are not cheap and are a priority. I just bought the new line of EGerber SA/GA boxes and paid $10 a piece. Yeah. "WOW!!" Good luck. Geno http://www.egerber.com http://www.bcemylar.com IP: Logged
dylanfan Member	posted April 26, 2003 11:12 AM Thanks so much for the detailed advice, guys. There's alot to think about here, and rightly so. We're talking about some amazing comics that need protecting. I'll let you all know how it goes. ------------------ Visit the Marvel Masterworks fansite and Message Board: Go to www.marvelmasterworks.freeservers.com IP: Logged
kdu Member	posted April 27, 2003 12:38 AM Well, for my 2 cents.... I like to use silver age bags with modern size boards (which are smaller). This makes it easier to get the comic in and out, cause there is more room. And my books like their space. IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted April 27, 2003 02:24 AM A safer strategy may be to use boards that fit the bags precisely, but to use a size of both that's larger than the book. This gives some added protection to the corners. IP: Logged
SteelBat2002 Member	posted April 27, 2003 06:12 AM quote: Originally posted by James Friel: A safer strategy may be to use boards that fit the bags precisely, but to use a size of both that's larger than the book. This gives some added protection to the corners. Exactly James. Which is why when I'm bagging and boarding my more valuable GA, SA and BA books I use magazine boards and cut them down to fit the Mylite side to side. Now a gripe. I have found in recent years that the manufactuers of boards, Comic Defense in particular,are skimping on the point size,(thickness), and the width especially. I find the new Comic Defense boards to be about as flimsy as a sheet of paper. So in recent years I have been using Comic Care. Now before anyone jumps on me. I do know that Comic Care and Comic Defense are both owned by Diamond and more then likely are manufactured at the same plant so I have no explanation for this. Maybe I will stop at the Diamond booth today at the Pittsburgh Con and ask them. In any case I remember when bagging my comics a few years back that the boards were most noticably thicker and also were wider then the comic itself. Like James mentioned above, the board spanning more then the width of the comic is important in the respect that it is protecting the corners. Geno IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted April 27, 2003 01:40 PM Point of inquiry? When did people start using boards? None of my collection have boards, but I stopped buying comics in 1990. None of the back issues I bought ever had boards either. So are boards something new since 1990, or was Oregon late to the party? IP: Logged
SteelBat2002 Member	posted April 27, 2003 03:25 PM quote: Originally posted by NecessaryImpurity: Point of inquiry? When did people start using boards? None of my collection have boards, but I stopped buying comics in 1990. None of the back issues I bought ever had boards either. So are boards something new since 1990, or was Oregon late to the party? Hmm, good question. I atempted a search on Google as to the history of bagging and boarding but pretty much came up empty. I'm going to venture a guess that boards came about in the very early eighties. Now bags on the other hand have been around since at least the mid to late seventies. I remember the first bag I ever saw I had gotten with a back issue I had purchased around 1979 or 1980 at one of the oldest comic shops in the country, Eides, here in Pittsburgh, who last year celebrated their 30th anniversary. *A note on boards that I failed to mention in my other posts above. I'm sure that a lot of you have noticed that there is a shiny and a dull side to boards. The dull side should be the side that comes in contact with the comic. Now admittedly I just learned this myself in the past year or so and had previously put the shiny side against the book. But this topic came up at my comic shop one day because of an article in Wizard and their response was that this was the correct way to do it. Which begs the question, "If the boards are acid free to begin with, what difference does it make?" So maybe it doesn't matter. ?? One last thing. I think its funny that we go to all this trouble to preserve our comics. I know I do. But what I'm getting at is that when I hear about or see books from the GA, SA that had been in all likelihood been sitting in a closet or attic for who knows how many years and they are in pristine shape it makes you wonder why we go to all the trouble we do to bag, board and box and keep them out of the light of day so the paper won't yellow and the colors won't fade. Has anyone here heard of the Edgar Church Collection/Mile High Collection? His books were stacked up on the floor of his house and sat there for years yet all were in Mint to Near Mint condition. Hmmm...interesting, isn't it? I'm still bagging and boarding mine. IP: Logged
kdu Member	posted April 27, 2003 04:20 PM I was told the slick side of the board goes against the comic. I've got old boards with the dull side to the comic and they have turned brown and picked up ghost images of the back cover (like a brown xerox). And I'll stand by my bag bigger than the boar practice, it makes bagging 100 and 80 pager easier . Of coursen now I'll probably lie awake all night worrying about corners... IP: Logged
NecessaryImpurity Member	posted April 27, 2003 04:31 PM quote: Originally posted by SteelBat2002: One last thing. I think its funny that we go to all this trouble to preserve our comics. I know I do. But what I'm getting at is that when I hear about or see books from the GA, SA that had been in all likelihood been sitting in a closet or attic for who knows how many years and they are in pristine shape it makes you wonder why we go to all the trouble we do to bag, board and box and keep them out of the light of day so the paper won't yellow and the colors won't fade. Has anyone here heard of the Edgar Church Collection/Mile High Collection? His books were stacked up on the floor of his house and sat there for years yet all were in Mint to Near Mint condition. Hmmm...interesting, isn't it? I'm still bagging and boarding mine. Because we move. If you have to move, you have to box them up. If you have any sort of hope for a monetary return, you have handle them with care (cue the Wilburys!). Every transfer from box to shelf is opportunity to mangle the book. If we never moved, and had the shelf space, there would be little need for the paraphenalia. IP: Logged
Live from Sagittarius A * Member	posted April 27, 2003 05:26 PM The most important thing to be aware of is "being aware" Express the importance to your friend to make sure they remove all tape from the old bags completely before pulling out comic.The tales of that valuable comic that becomes near-worthless because of tape grabbing on the comic cover is sad to say the least. Make sure all comics are properly placed in bag and box. Many times the back cover will fold as you insert them into the bag and you will not discover this until later when you are removing them. Comics slide and shift as you are placing them in a box, many times a comic will slip down and the bottom will be folded under the others. (bottom 1/4 is folded). I feel they should turn the box on end on place each book into the box one on etop of the other. then, after each box is full, they can safely place the box into an upright possition and secure the lid. Also make sure there are no gaps in box, if the box is not 90% full, I would suggest they store this box with books lying flat on top of each other. Because they are in bags and board, there is little chance of the comics developing a sloaping creace. IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted April 28, 2003 12:10 PM quote: Originally posted by NecessaryImpurity: Point of inquiry? When did people start using boards? People were using boards as early as the '70s in Michigan, where I was at the time, but the typical pattern, except for the very most anal collectors was to bag everything, but only board those books that were particularly valuable. The practice of boarding everything began some time in the '80s, I think, and was encouraged by the rise of the condition freaks to dominance in the market. Originally, in the early '70s, the Overstreet Guide had a 1-2-3 price ratio for Good-Fine-Mint. As condition consciousness took hold, the spread kept widening, to the point where it's now more like 1-3-15. I think boards have pretty much always been used with mylar, though. IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted April 29, 2003 03:57 AM Early Marvels in particular seem to be prone to browning, which inevitably means that brittleness follows, in addition to the well-known problem of "Marvel chips" at the edge of the covers. I think that Marvels of that period were probably printed somewhere other than World Color Press, and that the cover stock in particular was really cheap stuff. Both cheap newsprint and whatever the stuff was that Martin Goodman used for his cover stock in the early '60s (and for that matter all but the very finest paper) contains the chemical seeds of its own destruction: pretty fast destruction in the case of early Marvels--I've seen many books 20 years older that look a whole lot better in terms of paper quality than most of the early Marvels I've seen lately. If your friend's books are really as pretty as you say, and haven't yet begun to brown, he might look into deacidification--we are, after all, talking about several comics that are in the five-figure range if they're better than VF, and quite a few that are worth over a thousand. I know nothing myself about the process--I'm just suggesting its investigation, not vouching for its efficacy or even its harmlessness. IP: Logged
comicsgeek New Member	posted April 30, 2003 05:44 PM I think the two most important thing in preserving comics is to keep them from light and to keep them stored in constant humidity. It is the CHANGE in humidity that does the damage. Dry is better but the key is NO CHANGE. IP: Logged
Silver Age Adam Member	posted April 30, 2003 05:56 PM quote: Originally posted by comicsgeek: I think the two most important thing in preserving comics is to keep them from light and to keep them stored in constant humidity. It is the CHANGE in humidity that does the damage. Dry is better but the key is NO CHANGE. Having brought my comics to LA from Houston TX, I can vouch for one down side to humidity: mildew. I haven't lost anything really valuable, but some of my books and old magazines caught the black plague while sitting innocently in a pile in my humid Houston closet. ------------------ Interested in joining Hal's Emerald Advancement Team? Check out www.glheat.cjb.net, and if you agree with our mission statement, then email the application to me at SilverAgeAdam@yahoo.com I INVITE YOU TO SUPPORT OPERATION EMERALD STORM!! Send your extra comic books to the families of our troops fighting in the Persian Gulf!! Emerald Storm c/o The American Red Cross 2700 Wilshire Blvd. Los Angeles, CA 90057 Attn: Gwendolyn Parrish IP: Logged
dylanfan Member	posted May 12, 2003 12:57 PM Thanks for all your help, guys. I really appreciate it. I've got an order in with Gerber for the 2mil mylites and backing boards. I can't wait to get started bagging these comics up! ------------------ Visit the Marvel Masterworks fansite and Message Board: Go to www.marvelmasterworks.freeservers.com IP: Logged
James Friel Member	posted May 12, 2003 04:03 PM Have fun! Reading stories in collections is great, but nothing beats the feel (and smell) of real old comics. IP: Logged
Schatzie Member	posted May 12, 2003 11:18 PM quote: Originally posted by Live from Sagittarius A : The tales of that valuable comic that becomes near-worthless because of tape grabbing on the comic cover is sad to say the least.* Been there, done that! I bought Batman #166, went home and pulled it out of the bag only to have the tape snag a part of the cover, and the rest, as they say, is history. I'm still bitter! IP: Logged

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